Answer 2-3 of these prompts with respect to W;t (the film we watched in class):
·
is
there value in suffering?
·
What
should we do about futile treatment?
·
When
should we having conversations about EOL?
·
What
do you need to do now, in order to have an acceptable experience dying? Cf Death
of Ivan Ilych, W;t, Being Mortal; Frontline – Facing Death.
·
What
can literature and the arts tell us about living and dying?
Is there value in suffering?
ReplyDeleteI do believe that there is value in suffering, to a certain extent. In the case of the film, W;t, you could see how Dr. Bearing, through her suffering, was reflecting on her past actions. This reflection caused her to feel guilt and regret about how she had denied kindness to her students. It was ironic because all she wanted now was someone to show her kindness. The value in her suffering is that it took her to be a low point, physically and mentally, for her to realize how much more important humanity was then she wanted to admit. However, as she started to suffer more, with the unbearable pain and the unconsciousness, I feel the suffering had little value for her anymore. She was too unaware of her surroundings, to even begin to think or reflect. But then it switched to creating value for Susie, the nurse. Throughout the entire film, Susie, was the only one in the hospital that showed Dr. Bearing that someone cared about her, as a human, and not her, as a research project. The value of Dr. Bearing’s suffering for Susie was to remind her that regardless of the state that the patient is in (whether responsive or not), they should be treated with respect and sympathy – as evidenced in the scene where Susie put lotion on Dr. Bearing’s hands because she had promised to continue to take care of her. Suffering forces a person to remember the good and happiness they have had, and it usually makes them strive to get through the suffering to see that “light at the end of the tunnel”.
When should we having conversations about EOL?
End-of-life conversations should be happening right now, while we are physically and mentally healthy. EOL conversations should happen long before there are needed, for fear that it will be too late and that you will not be able to express the life-saving treatments you want, or lack of even. People to make living wills or talk to their family members about what they want when it comes down to situations where death is at the door, so if the individual is not "competent", their family can come forth with a document to prove that this particular treatment is what the dying individual wants. It is also important to designate a person in your life who will represent you. I do not want to be kept alive by machines for an excessive amount of time, so I would have to make sure that I pick someone who could be mentally capable of making that hard decision to pull the plug, setting aside the desire to avoid saying goodbye.
What can literature and the arts tell us about living and dying?
I think literature and the arts tell us about living and dying, portraying both easy lives and easy deaths and the flipside, of hard lives and hard deaths. I think the fascinating thing about freedom that comes with books and movies is that there are 1,000+ different types of characters and storylines, which means that the reader or viewer is bound to find some character they can relate to. The arts can influence our own thoughts and views about how our lives are or should be, and how are deaths should or could be, which could be both good and bad. Someone could watch a movie that portrays a character living this wonderful, happy life and then they could look at their life and feel self-pity. Or they could watch a movie about a character struggling throughout the entire movie and the viewer can be appreciative and thankful for the life they live. Sometimes movies about death can cause people to think about death in a way that they never thought about before. In the film, W;t, Dr. Bearing’s love for poetry and reading allowed her to explore death before hers was right before her. The arts allow us to come as close to experiencing certain things in life, without actually have to experience them.
I really like what you have said about literature and the arts telling us about living and dying. I think through these aspects you can discover a lot about death and dying through other peoples experiences and maybe even their regrets. I agree that the arts can influence our own thoughts and views about how life should be or death.
DeleteI definetly agree we need to address EOL conversations early on and having someone who can represent us who are able to follow through with our wishes. I also would not want to be kept alive by machines if I were in that situation, so it is really important to make sure we designate someone who can handle this decision.
DeleteI really lied what you had to say about literature and arts regarding living and dying. I agree that these can help us learn a lot about the death process in a different way.
Deleteis there value in suffering?
ReplyDeleteI believe there is value in suffering. Through suffering comes a realizations. When you go through a tremendous amount of suffering you realize things about your life, maybe it is things you need to change if there is still time or like Dr. Bearing you are realizing maybe you should have done things differently in your life. Her suffering took her on a journey of many different emotions, she had highs and lows, and through suffering she also decided her end of life care. She had to suffer alone which puts more value on when she did have that one visitor, which made her feel much better it seemed. Suffering causes a person to realize what is important, and begin to change aspects of their lives if their is time, suffering can help us discover things we had never known and cause people around us to realize things as well. Such as the nurse Suzie she watched her go through the suffering and she realized what Dr. Bearing had wanted and saw it through. She was kind to her throughout and sympathized with her and respected her. Suffering can be very bad but it does have value.
When should we having conversations about EOL?
We should be having end of life conversations right now, maybe even should have been at a younger age. It is important to have these discussions now so what you want is out in the open. If something were to happen your family will know what you want and the emotional burden of having to make those choices along with whatever happened to you would be devastating to family. You also get the piece of mind that what you want to happen will be done. We should all be having these conversations and possibly even creating a living will as soon as possible. I would not want the choice to be made for me and I would not have to make the choice at the last possible moment like Dr. Bearing. These conversations are extremely important.
I agree with you, EOL conversations should happen sooner rather than later. I also think it is important to make sure your family and loved ones know what you want to happen in certain situations. I like how you said it gives us a piece of mind and having a living will.
DeleteI think suffering can have value. Unfortunately, I think that the value is at the end of life when you realize that it’s too late to make changes. In the movie Wit, Dr. Bearing demonstrates this when she is diagnosed with ovarian cancer stage 4. I think the value from suffering is individualized. I think each of us has a plan for our future and when that plans change it is hard to recreate a new plan. I also think that each of us identify suffering differently. One definition of suffering states to undergo or feel pain or distress. If someone is dying I do not think they should have to suffer with pain.
ReplyDeleteEOL conversations should be discussed with individuals who are sick and dying. I think each situation will depend on how sick the person is. For example if someone is diagnosed with cancer but in the early stages and has a possibility to continue on with life, then I think that the discussion should be attempted, but in a manner that will suggest the idea that they could die, but not likely. If someone is elderly, sick, coherent and in the hospital this is a good opportunity to talk to them. I think as long as they are able to understand the situation they are in, death should be talked about with them. If it is a young child, I think death is not appropriate conversation for them, but they need to know how sick they are and what could happen.
I think there are many things that I would want to do in order to accept death. I want to be able to see my son grow up and be successful, explore the world, finish school and work as a nurse to help others in need, and repair relationships that have gone bitter.
I feel that literature and arts help us to understand the true meaning of death. We use language to communicate and express our feelings towards one another. I think art and literature help me to understand different views about life and death. I think that fear of death is based on a misunderstanding, but that dying is an opportunity for a person to grow. If we live consciously and totally, death is not devastation but a happy peak.
What should we do about futile treatment?
ReplyDeletePersonally, I say we do away with futile treatment. Its not necessary and will not help the patient in the long run. It takes away time left on earth that is supposed to be relaxing. Instead, most futile treatments leave people in agony and pain as in the case of the movie we watched, wit. I think the problem to giving futile treatments starts with over optimistic doctors and their need to try new things. The matter of fact is that anyone with stage 4 cancer has little time to live and its almost certain treatment will not help. I see it best to let life take its course and be more inclined to give palliative care. Get the patient in a relaxed state of mind so they are not in excruciating pain right before they die. The doctors didn't really give the woman in the movie a choice at all, they just said she was going to get the highest dose of cancer treatment...little did she know, the doctors pretty much knew it wouldn't work. She sadly caught onto this as treatment progressed.
When should we having conversations about EOL?
ReplyDeleteI think the appropriate conversations about the end of life should start from beginning of a harsh diagnosis. Anyone needs to know that they may die in a life threatening situation. Its important to talk about it before its too late.
I do agree with you it is important to have this conversation when the patient is clear in the head, but i also think right at the beginning of the treatment is a hard time to put all of that on the patient. I feel one step at a time is better then throwing all that information on a person.
DeleteIs there value in suffering?
ReplyDeleteI believe that there is value in suffering, but I think that it depends on the person and the situation to an extent. In the film, even though Dr. Bearing was suffering a great amount, she was still reflecting on her life and her choices. This reflection caused her to feel a sense of remorse for how she treated her students. Her suffering shows value in that at her lowest point, she was able to finally see how important life and kindness is. Suffering, for her, brought realization for the truly important aspects of life. However at a certain point, I think her suffering started to have less value to her. She was suffering so much and in so much pain she cared about little else than that pain ending, she no longer cared about reflection and learning. The nurse Susie showed a sense of value in her suffering in that throughout it all, she was by Dr. Bearing’s side caring for her and advocating for her.
What should we do about futile treatment?
I do not agree with futile treatments and do not think they should be used. Much like in the case with the movie we watched, they cause the patient more pain and harm than they do comfort. In Dr. Bearing's case, she should have been given the time she had left to live in comfort the way she choose to.
When should we having conversations about EOL?
End of life conversations should be happening while we are still young and able to make decisions for ourselves. We should be having these conversations with our families now while we are still in good health and able to convey our thoughts and wishes. It is better for EOL conversations to happen earlier than later. This is better so that years later when we are old and not mentally with it or in a position to make decisions whether we are old or still young, our family knows what we want them to do.
In order to have an acceptable experience dying, I think we need to start accepting death early on. People know death is inevitable, but many people are scared of it and don’t like to think about the end of their time. I think in order to have an acceptable experience dying, we also need to have a living will. This ensures our dying wishes are granted and takes less stress off our loved ones. Also, I think we should strive to be someone we are going to be proud of. In the end, Dr. Bearing regretted how she treated her students. Another example comes from Death of Ivan Ilych, when Ivan Ilych is dying, he is so regretful of how he treated his family and how he lived his life. He didn’t live the life he wanted to and regretted focusing so much on material things. Based on this, I think the best thing to do to accept our experience dying, is to focus on living to the fullest. Sure, we will have regrets in life, but I think we need to change the things that don’t make us happy. If we are full of regrets and unhappiness when we reflect on our lives, it makes the dying process that much more difficult.
ReplyDeleteWhen should we having conversations about EOL?
EOL conversations should be discussed early on in our lives because you never know when it may be your time. As I have said before, I think living wills need to be made, ensuring we get what we want. For the majority of us, we are very healthy (mentally and physically), which allows us to logically think about our end. As seen in w;t, Dr. Bearing did not have time to truly think about her end of life choices due to the severity of the cancer. The decision was made for her and I don’t want to put myself in that situation where I am ending my life the way I want to.
What should we do about futile treatment?
ReplyDeleteI think that futile treatment should be offered to everyone, but doesn't have to be taken by everyone and most definitely should not be forced upon patients. In the movie Dr. Bearing was receiving futile treatment, but it was being forced upon her. The doctors did not give her other options, and knew that the treatment probably wouldn't work. Futile treatment when wanted, is okay and allows the patient to prepare themselves and allow their family to prepare for their death as well.
When should we having conversations about EOL?
End of life conversations should take place when the person is comfortable with it. Some End of life conversations happen when someone receives a grim diagnosis or prognosis. Some make these conversations happen after the loss of a loved one. These conversations can happen at any point in life, young or old, and occur when a person feels the time is right.
When should we having conversations about EOL?
ReplyDeleteNOW. tomorrow is never guaranteed and we never know what could happen to someone. we need to discuss with them now what they would or would not want if an EOL decision needed to be made for that patient. Their wishes need to be expressed so that they are able to have all the treatment they would want.
is there value in suffering?
Everyone suffers at points in their life, sometimes it breaks us and sometimes it makes us stronger people because we went through that. There is value in suffering to me to an extent because it makes you appreciate all the good that you have had in your life and value that more than what is making you suffer.
What do you need to do now, in order to have an acceptable experience dying?
I do not want to be in an extreme amount of pain when I die. If I can be in manageable pain and still be coherent enough to communicate with my family and loved ones than that is ok. I want to be able to say goodbye if possible and when my time comes I don't want it to be a traumatic experience for my family to see. I want to go peacefully.
There can be lessons learned in suffering. We suffer throughout our lives, some example are, funerals, failing a class, break-ups, losing a gig sports game, the list goes on. We can learn from suffering, it shapes our lives in a way. But the way she was suffering in the movie was different. She had no one left in her life to keep her going, she didn't have anything to look forward to. She was just straight suffering, and in the instinct I do not believe that suffering has any value.
ReplyDeleteI believe to have an acceptable experience dying we have to have a strong and happy life. That consists of different things for different people. If that consists of having children, then having grandchildren, or walking their daughters down the isle, it just depends on the person. Everyone knows they will die at sometime, you cant outrun it, it is going to happen. So it is important to do the things in life that make you happy and when it is your time to go you will be ready.
I think that there is value in suffering. When people suffer they see things differently. They can realize what is important in life. In the movie w;t she realized that she should have done things a bit differently. For example when her student came to her and asked for an extension on his paper because his grandmother died and she said no. she realized that she should have been more compassionate to other people’s suffering. I think that when people suffer people realize that they should value things that are important like family. When people are suffering they realize that it might be too late to fix the things that they had done before. It is important to live like you are suffering and realize the important stuff in life. You should treat people how you would want to be treated.
ReplyDeleteSuffering can teach in a way. I believe that with this film it shows through her suffering it is taught what to appreciate and gives her time to remissness. Suffering may seem horrible but in ways it can give value to the life lived and shows you what good things you have been blessed with.
ReplyDeleteWith futile treatment I think there needs to be a limit to it, meaning at a certain point there has to be someone that say this needs to stop because nothing is changing. I think we need to really talk to the patient and teach them of their condition to reduce the amount of futile treatment that we are allowing to occur, because this treatment is causing more pain sometimes rather than helping anyone.
I feel that the appropriate time to have EOL conversation is when it can clearly be seen that the patient has no real hope. For example, in the movie when she was getting to the point of unbearable pain would be the right time to talk to her about it. The EOL conversation needs to happen when the patient can clearly understand it as well.
ReplyDeleteI do believe that there is some value in suffering. Through the woman’s suffering in the movie you could see how much it was allowing her to reflect on her life and her past decisions. I think that futile treatment should be continued until the patient no longer wants it. The woman in the movie decided that she wanted to be DNR and when she got sick enough to code the obnoxious med-student ran in and beginning performing CPR and when the nurse screamed at him to stop because she had clearly stated that she did not want to be resuscitated and his response was that she was research and he continued to try to resuscitate her. This scene made me really sad because her wishes were not being honored because she was being viewed as an educational stool than a human being. I feel as if end of life treatment should be talked about before we are ever diagnosed with a terminal illness or before an accident happens and our family members have to make choices for us. It’s better in my mind to have the conversation before hand than not have your wishes honored. I think that sometimes literature and arts makes dying seem more glamorous than it is. W;t gave a real account of what enduring chemo is, I feel like without witnessing its effects first hand most people just know general things like it makes your hair fall out and makes you throw up. When in reality the illness and the treatment are brutal and hell for anyone enduring it and watching their loved ones going through it.
Is there value in suffering?
ReplyDeleteI think there is value in suffering. Suffering silently or with a brave face shows the strength and dignity of someone when all else has failed them. When one is suffering like the woman in the movie, especially suffering towards death, it allows them to reflect on their life as a whole, how they lived, and who they were. This time or reflection is priceless I think because some people do not get that.
Futile treatment?
While it is sad that futile treatment can offer no cure or definite extra time, I think it does offer the patient hope and possibly peace of mind. While this doesn't mean much to some people, in the face of death I think it means a lot. I do however think futile treatment should be noninvasive. Meaning it does not put the patient in anymore pain or cause anymore suffering than they are already experiencing. Futile treatment should offer the patient comfort and relief in their final days.
When should we having conversations about EOL?
ReplyDelete- I think we should have our discussions about end of life as soon as possible. I think we should have them sooner than later because you never know what tomorrow may bring and what may happen. Also having EOL discussions earlier will relieve the family from stress if they end having to make any decisions themselves about another family members life.
What do you need to do now, in order to have an acceptable experience dying?
- I think some things that people need to know before they die is knowing whether or not they lived a happy and meaningful life. Some people might have regrets at the end of their life thinking about things that they wish they would have done but didn't. For me personally there are a number of things I want to do in my life before I die. So if I'm able to do most of these things before I die and if I'm able to say that i lived a happy life. I think I'll be able to have a more acceptable experience dying.